I left this on their board:
I guess I'm confused. How does any person know for certain this animal died? Based on their expert opinion? I can't see how any person, looking at a picture, can tell what happened to that non tagged shark after it swam away in a large body of water, let alone the ocean.
I'm not a scientist, nor was I there when this happened. I know Monday morning quarterbacking when I read it though.
I realize biologists that study these animals in the wild have a whole other perspective than the anglers. Both would be better served to have a working relationship with each other.
That is, if the ultimate objective is truly the welfare and conservation of the species.
This incident seemed to be within the parameters of the current guidelines for catch and release as it is written. I called the FWC and spoke at length about this event. The sources I spoke with didn't see any violation of law either. I brought the images with me, as well as this young man's report that the author mentions in his summary of events. No violation was found in what was shown.
If the author has an opinion on the law, based on his own viewpoint, that's his right.
Personal opinions do not factor into how these laws should be enforced or interpreted.
Show the studies that support your hypothesis, and make your case, it's that simple.
I think you will find many anglers (myself included) much more inclined to listen to a scientific explanation instead of conjecture.
If possible, could you also include the catch data of long line vessels and trawlers? It should be brought into the discussion as well, since they kill off thousands of more endangered animals every year commercially.
A commercial industry whose by catch, just happens to kill more sharks than any other form of oceanic harvest. That holds true in all of the world's oceans, not just the Gulf or the Atlantic.
Like I mentioned earlier, I'm not a scientist, but I would think the kill numbers may be much higher than any land based angler group using rods and reels.
This inconvenient truth seems to get glossed over by biologists and lawmakers from time to time.
I don't mean to be contrite, but I wish your response to be accurate.
Why is it easier to target law abiding anglers, than it is to stop a 100 ton fishing vessel? Especially when the vessel is slaughtering sharks by the hundreds each day it operates??
I have never understood that concept....
Long line trawlers kill more sharks than any other form of oceanic harvest in the world's oceans. They don't cut their lines and let the shark swim away either, as you already know. The animals are finned and thrown overboard in most cases.
Where are the studies on that ecosystem impact being done?
Like it or not, recreational anglers drive a multi billion dollar sport economy in the United States. $722 million was spent by recreational anglers in the state of Florida alone in 2009.
Ironically, some of these revenues fund alot of the research grants you and other biology majors enjoy as students right now, and in the future.
Writing a piece on the alleged "killing of a protected species" -without evidence- will garnish attention. If that was your goal,then it seems you accomplished what you intended.
A sensational opinion is not going to solve the issue here. We have to work together to find a solution .
Apparently, they don't want to talk about the bigger picture. Not surprising.
Thanks for posting.
Just an average fisherman.
Thanks for your passion in our sport. Those people can go piss up a rope IMO.
Very well written bro. I don't take much stock in what those guys have to say. Their info is flawed, numbers a doctored to how they think it best suits them. I wont say names but someone I know very well took out a bunch of NOAA and post grads? Out on a longline vessel for a lot of money to "do research" five or six trips at ten days in length. They insisted on fishing particular spots in the Gulf where the Capt told them they're not going to catch anything but they insisted on fishing those spots anyway. I believe that is one of the reasons the "grouper stocks are so depleted". Ya know? They were fishing barren flat bottom, told they wont catch a damn thing by a Capt and Mate who have been doing this for many years. Guess they came home and reported how few grouper they caught. There's some of our fish stock numbers right there. That's why I don't take much stock in what alleged scientists have to say.
Will - I dont know thes guys personally (slasherx4 or charkbait) but you and the rest of the members here should be very proud to have them here. Mark has handled this catch with the upmost respect for both the shark itself and the reactions of some of the posters. Both of these members are well spoken, knowledgeable, cool headed gentlemen that represent themselves VERY well. I want to personally thank you charkbait for your well written response - great job ! Follow these guys lead everyone - this is the way to hold our ground in this sport.
I left this on their board:
I guess I'm confused. How does any person know for certain this animal died? Based on their expert opinion? I can't see how any person, looking at a picture, can tell what happened to that non tagged shark after it swam away in a large body of water, let alone the ocean.
I'm not a scientist, nor was I there when this happened. I know Monday morning quarterbacking when I read it though.
I realize biologists that study these animals in the wild have a whole other perspective than the anglers. Both would be better served to have a working relationship with each other.
That is, if the ultimate objective is truly the welfare and conservation of the species.
This incident seemed to be within the parameters of the current guidelines for catch and release as it is written. I called the FWC and spoke at length about this event. The sources I spoke with didn't see any violation of law either. I brought the images with me, as well as this young man's report that the author mentions in his summary of events. No violation was found in what was shown.
If the author has an opinion on the law, based on his own viewpoint, that's his right.
Personal opinions do not factor into how these laws should be enforced or interpreted.
Show the studies that support your hypothesis, and make your case, it's that simple.
I think you will find many anglers (myself included) much more inclined to listen to a scientific explanation instead of conjecture.
If possible, could you also include the catch data of long line vessels and trawlers? It should be brought into the discussion as well, since they kill off thousands of more endangered animals every year commercially.
A commercial industry whose by catch, just happens to kill more sharks than any other form of oceanic harvest. That holds true in all of the world's oceans, not just the Gulf or the Atlantic.
Like I mentioned earlier, I'm not a scientist, but I would think the kill numbers may be much higher than any land based angler group using rods and reels.
This inconvenient truth seems to get glossed over by biologists and lawmakers from time to time.
I don't mean to be contrite, but I wish your response to be accurate.
Why is it easier to target law abiding anglers, than it is to stop a 100 ton fishing vessel? Especially when the vessel is slaughtering sharks by the hundreds each day it operates??
I have never understood that concept....
Long line trawlers kill more sharks than any other form of oceanic harvest in the world's oceans. They don't cut their lines and let the shark swim away either, as you already know. The animals are finned and thrown overboard in most cases.
Where are the studies on that ecosystem impact being done?
Like it or not, recreational anglers drive a multi billion dollar sport economy in the United States. $722 million was spent by recreational anglers in the state of Florida alone in 2009.
Ironically, some of these revenues fund alot of the research grants you and other biology majors enjoy as students right now, and in the future.
Writing a piece on the alleged "killing of a protected species" -without evidence- will garnish attention. If that was your goal,then it seems you accomplished what you intended.
A sensational opinion is not going to solve the issue here. We have to work together to find a solution .
"Will - I dont know thes guys personally (slasherx4 or charkbait) but you and the rest of the members here should be very proud to have them here. Mark has handled this catch with the upmost respect for both the shark itself and the reactions of some of the posters. Both of these members are well spoken, knowledgeable, cool headed gentlemen that represent themselves VERY well. I want to personally thank you charkbait for your well written response - great job ! Follow these guys lead everyone - this is the way to hold our ground in this sport." X2 I agree, without anglers like a lot of the men and women on this forum our sport would not be where it is today. I read all of the comments on that blog and was pleased to see a few names I recognized and well written comments from them. I do not have the self control to comment intelligently without becoming angry and writing a whole lot of nonsense. I thank you guys (all who posted) for portraying us properly as I cannot.
To be honest, the guys with FWC were a bit surprised about the whole blowup. They didn't see anything wrong with what was done. This really bothered me when I saw it. I couldn't leave it alone. I was told on that site's blog on this matter to "refrain from speaking about the global picture" and that they were focused on more "local" matters. They referred me to read articles on their site for information in this regard. I'm still confused as to why they won't recognize the bigger picture.
Try talking to them..it's a pure joy. They don't have any opinion other than their own. They claim they want to have a friendship, and an "understanding" in their typed words. That's their public face anyways. They refuse to see any other method other than theirs as being correct, yet ,somehow LBSF is a bane for all sharks unless you cut off 30' of leader when a dorsal fin cuts the water...... I came to the conclusion they must be suffering because they are liberals........it wasn't very productive.
Aren't they suposed to be stewards of the same oceans? Where is their outrage towards the real travesty that is in the ravaging commercial harvest of sharks?
I don't think it matters what state you are from either. I'll drive, make phone calls, write letters, protest wearing peanut butter, whatever may help-the public does not know how truly deceitful these people truly are....They need to be exposed for what they are.
We have more pressure than ever to be good stewards ourselves on the beaches we fish. If we are seperate in our approach to this rhetoric, we will all eventually suffer collectively. As a group we must have a united front.
Btw Scout, you do know me, at least by phone that is. My screen name on SOS is clevrrr1.
Tight Lines-
Mark Conner
I have left my first hand experience of exactly what happened on their site as well and I'm certain that we broke no current laws. In fact I think we went above the call of duty in our handling of the shark and made great efforts to make sure it was released successfully. As others have already mentioned, this scientist's efforts would be better placed in combating the scourge of longline vessels and the indiscriminate killing of sharks for the Chinese shark fin market.
It's all good brother. Let's keep the truth out there!!!!! They seem to shy away from that.
I was 100% sure that any time when you reach UP, someone comes to hunt you down. It's always like that - no matter on what type of filed that would be. Like all IT guys say - "Prevention is your best weapon against - bad guys (in our case - referring to cyber-criminals)".
I would suggest to William - to create a forum section that can only be accessed by REGISTERED USERS - where these type of reports can be viewed ONLY AFTER SIGNING ON.
This is the BEST technical solution to prevent ALL THESE CRAPPY comments and "Unauthorized Photo Copy" to be made by other websites. Period!
It makes me smile how these guys talk about legal action against Mark, when yet - they clearly broke the law by copying an Copyrighted Content WITHOUT WRITTEN PERMISSION OF THE OWNER. HOW ABOUT THAT?
If that would be my picture there - my lawyer would-of long ago be on they case - that's for sure.
Claiming to know whats best for these animals, but yet - brake the law - copyright infringement - just proves how dumb you have to be. Sorry for my direct opinion.
This should tell you who these guys are in reality and how fair they play they game: I posted there a comment about mentioning the unwritten consent of copying pictures and phrases from this website, and sure enough - they deleted that comment. Probably they just starting to realize that - copyright infringement - is actually an illegal act. Which means that - that whole article should not contain Marks picture nor any of the phrases and comments posted on this website. That - includes private conversations as well. Did you ever wonder why is called private? Well - that's because they should remain private unless agreed by BOTH parts to be published.
For thous who may not know this - if someone copies copyrighted content or partial content from a website to be published on another website without the original authors verbal/written consent - it's actually illegal under the copyright infringement laws. To understand this is plain english - read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement